Tag Archives: Job 11-15

Daily Bible Study

June 12, 2023 Bible Study — Sometimes People Draw The Wrong Conclusion From True Statements

Today, I am reading and commenting on  Job 11-15.

I have been trying to decide what to write about today’s passage for a few hours now.  I first thought to write that Job’s friends illustrate the lesson that those who are wrong can make arguments which sound convincing and right.  That is definitely true here: Job’s friends make some good points, but they were in the wrong, the argument they were making was wrong.  Then, I realized that while Job was closer to the truth than his friends, he was also wrong.  Job’s friends thought that because he was suffering, he was obviously a sinner, and because they were not suffering, they were obviously more righteous than he.  They thought they were better than him.  Job, on the other hand, challenged God’s justice and demanded that God explain to him why he was suffering.  So, I thought as I read this that this passage teaches us two things.  First, just because someone builds their argument using true statements does not mean that their conclusion is correct.  Second, just because someone reaches an incorrect conclusion does not mean that none of their arguments are valid.

I use the daily Bible reading schedule from “The Bible.net” for my daily Bible reading.

Daily Bible Study

June 12, 2022 Bible Study — We Cannot Tell From Surface Appearances Whether Someone Is Righteous Or Wicked

Today, I am reading and commenting on  Job 11-15.

I struggle with what to write about today’s passage.  Sometimes it feels like the Book of Job uses more words to make its point than necessary.  However, in part that is because we oversimplify the point this book is making.  The writer actually makes a very nuanced and complex point.  In today’s passage, Job’s friends essentially say that those who devote their hearts and lives to God, and only those who do so, will be wealthy and happy.  They say that the wicked are constantly tormented, and subject to sudden disasters, while the righteous never suffer such things.  Therefore, they say, we can conclude that anyone who is tormented, or subject to sudden disasters, is wicked., and those who are financially secure with stable lives must be righteous.  Job, on the other hand, expresses his desire to stand before God to be judged.  It is important to remember that at the end of the book when God speaks, while He admonishes Job for challenging His justice,  He calls upon Job’s friends to ask Job to pray for them.

I use the daily Bible reading schedule from “The Bible.net” for my daily Bible reading.

Daily Bible Study

June 12, 2021 Bible Study Suffering Is Not Evidence Of Wrongdoing

Today, I am reading and commenting on  Job 11-15.

The first thing I noticed today is that Job’s friends were guilty of the straw man fallacy.  They condemn Job for things he did not actually say.  I realized that Job became angrier as he attempted to restate his argument in order to address the ways in which they had misrepresented what he had said previously.  We can actually learn an important lesson from this: do not continue a debate with someone whose counterarguments focus on, and misrepresent, our examples or side notes rather than addressing our main point.  Actually there is another lesson as well: Job’s friends were so convinced that Job’s suffering was the result of some unknown wrongdoing that they did not really listen to what he said.

I want to revisit what I said above while looking more closely at what the characters in this passage say.  Zophar misrepresents what Job said in his first monologue, then he essentially tells Job that his suffering resulted from his sinfulness; that if Job had just been righteous he would not be suffering. Jesus addresses this idea in John 9 when his disciples asked Him whether the man born blind or his parents had sinned and Jesus replies “Neither.”  Job answered Zophar’s misrepresentation of what he had said with anger and restated his original point (and also says a few things worth thinking about, but I am not going to cover those today).  Then Eliphaz condemns Job for getting angry, misrepresents what Job had said, and also implies that Job’s suffering resulted from his wickedness.  Neither Zophar nor Eliphaz specified what wickedness Job had committed; they merely postulated that his suffering was evidence of him having committed it.  The important lesson here: suffering is not evidence of wrongdoing.

I use the daily Bible reading schedule from “The Bible.net” for my daily Bible reading.

Daily Bible Study

June 12, 2020 Bible Study Do Not Use the Pretense of Offering Comfort As an Excuse to Accuse Those Who Suffer

I am using the daily Bible reading schedule from “The Bible.net” for my daily Bible reading.

Today, I am reading and commenting on Job 11-15.

It is tempting to think that the Book of Job is just about realizing that just because someone is suffering does not mean that they have committed some heinous sin.  However, if that was all it was about, it would not need to be as long as it is.  Zophar voices another of the mistakes which we can make.  He tells Job that all he needs to do to end his depression and suffering is lift his hands to God in prayer and leave all iniquity behind him.  Zophar says that if Job does that, his life will be joyful once more.  Elsewhere in the Bible we see that there is something to this idea, but the context here reveals to us that it is not completely true.  Job’s response to Zophar should show us that when attempting to comfort those who are suffering sometimes it is better to remain silent than to offer what we think are solutions, but are really accusations.

In several of Job’s responses to his friends we see foreshadowing of Jesus’ ministry.  In yesterday’s passage, Job asked for a mediator between himself and God.  A role which Jesus died on the cross to take.  In today’s passage, Job tells us that if the dead can live again, then he could have hope in the anguish he suffered.  Further, Job tells us that if the dead can live again, God would guard our steps and cover over our sins.  Jesus rose from the dead to fulfill that very hope.

 

Daily Bible Study

June 12, 2019 Bible Study — Only If The Dead Can Live Again, Can We Have Hope

I am using the daily Bible reading schedule from “The Bible.net” for my daily Bible reading.

Today, I am reading and commenting on Job 11-15.

Zophar’s response shows us the perils of being involved in a debate with more than one person.  He takes what Job has said to counter the other two and answers it from a different direction.  Zophar says one thing which is true for all of us, God punishes us far less than we deserve.  The problem is that Zophar’s statement is aimed solely at Job and does not include himself.  Zophar’s whole statement is that Job is suffering because he is a sinner and all Job needs to do to stop suffering is stop sinning, confess his sins, and beg God for forgiveness.  Then all will be lilies and roses.  Zophar does not actually know what sins Job has committed.  He just “knows” that he must have committed some heinous sin to be suffering as he is.  The main point of this book is that suffering is not always evidence that someone committed a great sin. 

Job’s next monologue contains many truths.  First, several times he says something his friends should have said themselves and that each of us should keep in mind: Job’s friends were no better than he.  And, what they were saying was not something known only to them.  I strive to remember both of these things.  I believe that I am pretty good at making people aware that I do not think I am better than they, but I struggle to remember that others often know the same insights which have come to me. 

In this monologue Job asks a rhetorical question, “Can the dead live again?”  He is sure that the answer is no, but he says something from which those who believe in the death and resurrection of Christ take great comfort.  If the dead can live again, then we have a basis for hope when we suffer.  And since Christ rose from the dead we know that the dead can indeed live again.  We know that death is not the end, so we can endure suffering knowing that even if it leads to death, God will raise us again to live with Him.

When Eliphaz first spoke, he made minor errors.  This time he gets too caught up in convincing Job that he is wrong.  Previously, Eliphaz had merely suggested that Job had sinned.  This time he makes it a full-blown accusation.  Yet, he cannot site what terrible sin Job has committed.  He has judged Job guilty of some terrible, unknown sin just because Job is suffering.  Eliphaz makes one true statement in this monologue: no man is truly pure, all have sinned.  However, he fails to see that this means that he also has sinned and is just as deserving of suffering as Job. 

 

Daily Bible Study

June 12, 2018 Bible Study — Offering Comfort to Those Suffering From Depression

I am using the daily Bible reading schedule from “The Bible.net” for my daily Bible reading.

Today, I am reading and commenting on Job 11-15.

    As I begin reading this I am reminded of a post by a friend on Facebook about suicide awareness which I saw this morning, expressing their struggle with depression. In today’s passage the third of Job’s friends replies to him. Zophar tells Job that he deserves to suffer and almost certainly deserves to suffer even more than he is. According to Zophar only the wicked suffer, while the godly always lead pleasant lives. Even if this was not wrong, it would be a terrible thing to say to someone whose suffering is already causing them to flirt with the idea of dying, as Job’s previous comments make clear is true of Job. However, Job responds by telling Zophar, and the other two, that they are no better than he. And this is one of the first things we must make clear when we confront those whose sin is causing their suffering: I am no better than you. Actually, that is a message for us to communicate to anyone who is suffering.

    AS I further read Job’s response to Zophar I am struck by how often some of what he says is echoed by those who are suicidal. All too often we mock those who are struggling and provide a push to those who contemplating taking their own life. While at the same time allowing those who bring harm to others to live in peace. It would be better for us to remain silent in the presence of those who are suffering than to give them the same useless advice proffered by Job’s friends.

    I mentioned yesterday that I struggle with reading the Book of Job because of the need to keep in mind what God says to the people in it at the end. Well, in many ways that is a good reason to read through the book time and again, the book contains a lot for us to learn. And this brings us to another passage in it which I struggle to write about clearly:

Can the dead live again?
   If so, this would give me hope through all my years of struggle,
   and I would eagerly await the release of death.
You would call and I would answer,
   and you would yearn for me, your handiwork.
For then you would guard my steps,
   instead of watching for my sins.
My sins would be sealed in a pouch,
   and you would cover my guilt.

Job started this with a rhetorical question for which he thought the answer was “No”. He then goes on to tell us how things would be different for those suffering from depression if the answer was “Yes”. And that is the wonderful thing because, in Christ, the answer is indeed, “Yes, the dead can live again.” Which means that we do not need to fear death. In fact we can embrace our coming death because what awaits us beyond it is so much better. But there is more to it than that, because the dead can live again, God yearns for us and guards our steps. He has sealed our sins in a pouch and has covered our sins with the blood of Jesus.

Daily Bible Study

June 12, 2017 Bible Study — Offer Comfort To Those Who Suffer, Not Condemnation

I am using the daily Bible reading schedule from “The Bible.net” for my daily Bible reading.

Today, I am reading and commenting on Job 11-15.

    Job’s friends continue to tell him that he must have committed some heinous sin that explains his suffering. If only he would confess his sin and seek God’s forgiveness his suffering would end and his life would be wonderful once more. The ongoing theme of the Book of Job is that it is wrong to use suffering as evidence that someone has sinned. Actually the theme is more than that. Our answer to the suffering of others should not be to tell them that if only they confessed their sins they would stop suffering…even if we know that their suffering results from sin. We should offer comfort to those who suffer, acknowledging that we deserve to suffer just as much as they for our sins. We should do our best to relieve the pain experienced by those suffering, not add to it by accusing them of sin.

    In his response to his friends, says some things which stand out as important. He reminds us of the time tested truth that wisdom and understanding come with age, but he points out that God possesses wisdom and power far beyond that which we acquire with age. If we need counsel and understanding we can obtain it by turning to God. He also warns us against lying to defend God, or to convince others to turn to Him. It will go badly for us if we attempt to use lies and deception to lead others to God. God does not need, nor does He want us to use lies and deception to defend Him against accusations, nor to convince people to trust Him. Lies and deception may work in the short term, but God is only interested in the long term where they are sure to fail. We should fear to make the case for God with things we know to be false and/or misleading.

    Then Job asks the rhetorical question which God answered anyway in Jesus Christ. When Job asked the question, “Can the dead live again?” he thought he knew the answer and that the answer was “No.” From his position of not realizing that God has provided that the dead can live again, Job tells us what it means to believe that. It means that we have hope through all of our years of struggle, whether those years be many or few. If we believe that the dead will rise again, we should view death as a release and eagerly await it. God has indeed sealed our sins in a pouch and watches over our steps. The fact that we will rise from the dead with Christ means that we should seek and strive and struggle to find and do God’s will for all of our lives.

Daily Bible Study

June 12, 2016 Bible Study — Can the Dead Live Again?

I am using the daily Bible reading schedule from “The Bible.net” for my daily Bible reading. I had been using One Year Bible Online, but it was time for a change.

DSCN0588

Today, I am reading and commenting on Job 11-15.

    Zophar also accuses Job of being a sinner, solely on the basis of the fact that Job is suffering. Zophar’s logic is as follows: Job is suffering, therefore he must have sinned. As a matter of fact, as bad as Job is suffering, he probably deserves even worse. This is faulty logic. While it is true that actions have consequences and that what we are experiencing is usually a consequence of actions we have taken, not everyone who is suffering is doing so as a result of them doing wrong. Sometimes people suffer for doing right and sometimes people suffer for no reason that we can discern.

The Front Room

    Job’s response starts out somewhat sarcastic, commending them for their great wisdom and advice, when in fact they have told him nothing that is not well known and given him no advice upon which he can act. All they have told him is, “Confess your sins, whatever they are.” Yet when Job tells them that he does not know any sins he has committed all they can tell him is that he must have committed some sins, otherwise he would not be suffering. Job goes on to say that he knows that his suffering comes from the hand of God. He wants to make his case before God so that he can find out what sin he might have committed and amend his ways. If his friends can tell him what he has done wrong, he will gladly amend his ways, but if they cannot they should remain silent.

DSCN0587

    I was going over this and writing my thoughts as I read when I came to Chapter 14 verse 14 (and following). There Job asks a question, “Can the dead live again?” He then explores what it would mean if the answer is “Yes”. If the answer is “yes” (and it is indeed “yes”), then we can have hope in the suffering we experience in this life and we can eagerly await the release of death. Paul tells us in 1 Corinthians that if there is no resurrection of the dead, the entire Christian message is based on a lie. There is indeed a resurrection of the dead and therefore the things which Job says here are true. We are God’s handiwork and He yearns for us. God has offered to seal our sins away from us and cover them over with the blood of Jesus. He has called to us and all we need to do is answer. Then He will guard our steps for God has no desire to watch for our sins.